John Howard and the Inextricable Link Between Freedom and Faith

'Yet, there is hope for a road back to Judeo-Christian ideals.'

'Hope for a road'? If you want a Judeo-Christian America, then you only need to join the RCC and abide by its commandments.

'its roots were grounded in Judeo-Christian principles.'

Yes, and America's founders derived a certain thing from these principles - a consensus about what is good, and what is evil.

'If Christian Americans would spread messages of their faith'

Well, that's the duty of every confirmed Christian American, because the sacrament called 'confirmation' is an OBLIGATION to spread such messages.

'Dr. Carlson addressed that point, "In this election year, BOTH the Democratic and Republican parties will be actively courting Christian voters.'

McCain has not talked publicly about his religion during the 2008 campaign. Obama has, though. He has falsely claimed ties to the RCC, even though he is a Muslim. Obama has no ties to the RCC. Period.

'That influence, he said, "has been almost completely omitted in the history courses of the schools and colleges for more than six decades."'

Not only that, but also Religious Education is not taught in any American schools, and American public school students are not allowed to pray at school. One of the culprits is AU.

And if you want America to 'go back to Judeo-Christian roots', then she must ratify the Federal Marriage Amendment (FMA). Here's why:
Contrary to the claims of SSM proponents, a marriage is a union of a man and a woman according to the majority of (actually, almost all, except pseudo-religions like Anglicanism) denominations, including the two foremost - Catholicism and Islam. Neither Catholicism nor Islam nor Judaism nor Buddhism nor Hinduism nor Baptism nor Orthodox Christianity envisage SSMs. They are unanimous on this issue. So whatever God one prays to, his or her God has defined marriage as a union of a man and a woman. We humans are not authorised to change something that God has instituted. Moreover, marriage is a sacrament (it was created by the Divine Father as a non-sacrament, but elevated to the sacramental rank by God's Son). No one needs to mention human arguments like 'families cannot function without husbands'. There are very few atheists and Anglicans in the US. The US should not adopt the opinion of a minority.

Yes, there are few SSM proponents in the US. SSM legalisation is unpopular, so SSM proponents, unable to convince the American people to approve their proposal, will work via courts instead. Already two judicially activist state Supreme Courts have ruled that SSM marriage is legal. Now, SSM proponents will use the Equal Protection Clause to enforce SSM on all other 48 states, and on DC.

It is a bit sad that what purports to be a forum for conservative political thought should carry and endorse the clear and obvious distortions of this piece.

The Founders of our nation, some but clearly not all being Christian, went out of their way to signal their intent for a secular government. In the Constitution as drafted and amended by the Bill of Rights there are but two references to religion in general, none to Christianity: The 1st Amendment says, "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion. . ." and in Article VI, Section 3, ". . . no religious test shall ever be required as a qualification to any office or public trust under the United States."

That is it! No mention of God, Jesus, or the Christian religion. None.

In Article XI of Treaty of Tripoli (negotiated under Washington, ratified under Adams) we read: "As the Government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded on the Christian religion...".

Further, according to the historian, Robert T. Handy, "No more than 10 percent-- probably less-- of Americans in 1800 were members of congregations".

The philosophic roots of our government clearly lie in the Enlightment, with the likes of Rousseau and Locke, not in the Ten Commandments or the Sermon on the Mount.

Indeed it has been suggested that the great diversity in not only religion but Christianity itself in the U.S. is in large part due to the very seperation that the writer denies exists.

In as much as we have neither laws on our books nor clauses in the Constitution providing for the death penalty for adulterers, folks who choose to labor on the sabbath, and/or disobedient children, the claims of the writer must be considered laughable at best.

The US Con. doesn't mention God, but the Declaration of Independence does. It says that we humans were given certain inalienable rights by our Divine Creator.

And a religion is not a threat to a secular government. The RCC and the US Federal Government can support each other. No secular government has ever succeeded, and none ever will. John, if you want to live in a secular country, please relocate to this country:
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=z3nV8rrOi9E
Moreover, of all 42 American presidents, all but one (Jefferson, who was a deist) were Christians.
America's roots are Christian, not secular.

"The philosophic roots of our government clearly lie in the Enlightment, with the likes of Rousseau and Locke, not in the Ten Commandments or the Sermon on the Mount."

Obviously Dr Martin Luther King would disagree with this premise.

Actually all true human rights issues would never had been won if it were not for Christian-Judeo philosophy.

The problem with secularism is that all faith lies in government as opposed to a Divine Creator who endows our rights; this is the main reason why America is an exception in the world our rights are endowed by the Creator and not governments, kings, or dictators.

Mr. Mazurak -

Where I want to live is beside the point. (If you would feel more comfortable in a nation with strong governemtn-religion ties, I would suggest you relocate to Iran.)

You are also wrong about the faith of many of our Presidents. (Although that isn't important -- the question is not whether we are largely a nation of Christians, but rather whether we are or should be a Christian nation. The point is not unimportant, few would ague that because we are largely a nation of whites of European descent we are therefore a "white nation".)

WASHINGTON revealed almost nothing to indicate his spiritual frame of mind, hardly a mark of a devout Christian. In his thousands of letters, the name of Jesus Christ never appears. He rarely spoke about his religion, but his Freemasonry experience points to a belief in deism. Washington's initiation occurred at the Fredericksburg Lodge on 4 November 1752, later becoming a Master mason in 1799, and remained a freemason until he died.

After Washington's death, Dr. Abercrombie, a friend of his, replied to a Dr. Wilson, who had interrogated him about Washington's religion replied, "Sir, Washington was a Deist."

JOHN ADAMS, a Unitarian, flatly denied the doctrine of eternal damnation. In a letter to Thomas Jefferson, he wrote:

"I almost shudder at the thought of alluding to the most fatal example of the abuses of grief which the history of mankind has preserved -- the Cross. Consider what calamities that engine of grief has produced!"

In his letter to Samuel Miller, 8 July 1820, Adams admitted his unbelief of Protestant Calvinism: "I must acknowledge that I cannot class myself under that denomination."

In his, "A Defence of the Constitutions of Government of the United States of America" [1787-1788], Adams wrote:

"The United States of America have exhibited, perhaps, the first example of governments erected on the simple principles of nature; and if men are now sufficiently enlightened to disabuse themselves of artifice, imposture, hypocrisy, and superstition, they will consider this event as an era in their history. Although the detail of the formation of the American governments is at present little known or regarded either in Europe or in America, it may hereafter become an object of curiosity. It will never be pretended that any persons employed in that service had interviews with the gods, or were in any degree under the influence of Heaven, more than those at work upon ships or houses, or laboring in merchandise or agriculture; it will forever be acknowledged that these governments were contrived merely by the use of reason and the senses."

JAMES MADISON, principle author of the 1st Amendment, wrote all of the following:

"In no instance have... the churches been guardians of the liberties of the people.

Religion flourishes in greater purity, without than with the aid of Government.

Religious bondage shackles and debilitates the mind and unfits it for every noble enterprise, every expanded prospect.

The number, the industry, and the morality of the priesthood, and the devotion of the people have been manifestly increased by the total separation of the church from the state.

The purpose of separation of church and state is to keep forever from these shores the ceaseless strife that has soaked the soil of Europe with blood for centuries.

During almost fifteen centuries has the legal establishment of Christianity been on trial. What have been its fruits? More or less in all places, pride and indolence in the Clergy, ignorance and servility in the laity, in both, superstition, bigotry and persecution." Madison was a Deist.

No student of American History beleives Abraham Lincoln was a Christian, after his death even his wife wrote "...Mr. Lincoln was not a Christian..." But the best evidence is the following, written in his own hand: "The Bible is not my Book and Christianity is not my religion. I could never give assent to the long complicated statements of Christian dogma."

Finally, the "Creator" of the Declaration was the god of deism...not the god of Abraham. Again...the Founders - many if not most of whom were Deists (Jefferson, Franklin, Madison to name three of the better known) - crafted a Constitution specifically to prevent an unholy alliance between religion and government. It is only those who seek to overturn their work that now distort and deny the legacy the Founders left us.

In closing I will quote Bill Mahrer: "I have a problem with people who take the Constitution too loosely and the Bible too literally."

John Shuey said that the following is a quote from Abraham Lincoln:

"The Bible is not my Book and Christianity is not my religion..."

I have found that quote attributed to Mr. Lincoln at atheist websites, but if you go to the University of Michigan online Collected Worlds of Abraham Lincoln you will not find that quote.

http://quod.lib.umich.edu/cgi/t/text/text-idx?c=lincoln&cc=lincoln&type=simple&rgn=full+text&q1=The+Bible+is+not+my+Book+and+Christianity+is+not+my+religion&cite1=&cite1restrict=author&cite2=&cite2restrict=author&singlegenre=All&Submit=Search

This quote you will find at the University of Michigan Collected Works of Abraham Lincoln - in reference to the Bible:

In regard to this Great Book, I have but to say, it is the best gift God has given to man. All the good the Saviour gave to the world was communicated through this book. But for it we could not know right from wrong. All things most desirable for man's welfare, here and hereafter, are to be found portrayed in it. To you I return my most sincere thanks for the very elegant copy of the great Book of God which you present." Abraham Lincoln

http://quod.lib.umich.edu/cgi/t/text/text-idx?c=lincoln;cc=lincoln;type=simple;rgn=div1;q1=In%20regard%20to%20this%20great%20book;singlegenre=All;view=text;subview=detail;sort=occur;idno=lincoln7;node=lincoln7%3A1184

John Shuey said: "The philosophic roots of our government clearly lie in the Enlightment, with the likes of Rousseau and Locke, not in the Ten Commandments or the Sermon on the Mount."

In truth the roots of American government lie both in the Bible (God's Law) and in the enlightenment (Reason and Natural Law).

Reason alone cannot work as a means of creating a just society because of the contaminating presence of human evil. Human reason frequently falls on its face due to our ever-present animal nature with its greed, lust, hatred and violence.

This is why our Declaration of Independence mergers both ideas: God-given human rights (God's law) alongside a reasonable idea for just government power, i.e.: just government power derived through the consent of the governed (Reason and Natural Law).

The secular nature of American government is incorporated in the Declaration of Independence with the idea of just government power deriving from the consent of the governed, and it was put into practice in our secular Constitution; but we still have the all-important reality of Divine human rights. Our rights to life, liberty and creative pursuit of happiness do not derive only from human reason; human reason directed by evil has historically led to the undoing of sacred rights time after time.

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed..."

As they have even with Charles Darwin, PFCs (Prevaricators for Christ) are wont to create after-the-fact conversions, and Lincoln is no exception.

The sources you cited rely on one collection, there are others that are more inclusive.

Lincoln was very adept politically and fully aware of the necessity to win and maintain the approval of the electorate if he were to save the Union. But those who knew him best tell a different story:

The man who stood nearest to President Lincoln at Washington -- nearer than any clergyman or newspaper correspondent -- was his private secretary, Col. John G. Nicolay. In a letter dated May 27, 1865, Colonel Nicolay says: "Mr. Lincoln did not, to my knowledge, in any way change his religious ideas, opinions, or beliefs from the time he left Springfield to the day of his death."

That is an important statement because Lincoln was known in Springfield as a Deist and avid reader of Thomas Paine. In fact, in his first run for President, 20 of the 23 Christian pastors of Springfield voiced opposition to him. Lincoln later commented on that issue in a letter to Martin M. Morris which said, in part, "...it was everywhere contended that no Christian ought to go for me, because I belonged to no church, was suspected of being a deist, and had talked about fighting a duel."

His lifelong friend and executor, Judge David Davis, affirmed the same: "He had no faith in the Christian sense of the term."

Lincoln's friend and former law partner, William H. Herndon, wrote shortly after his death: "Mr. Lincoln was an infidel, sometimes bordering on atheism...He never mentioned the name of Jesus, except to scorn and detest the idea of a miraculous conception."

His biographer, Colonel Lamon, intimately acquainted with Lincoln in Illinois and with him during all the years that he lived in Washington says: "Never in all that time did he let fall from his lips or his pen an expression which remotely implied the slightest faith in Jesus as the son of God and the Savior of men."

And finally in his (well documented) own words: "My earlier views of the unsoundness of the Christian scheme of salvation and the human origin of the sriptures have become clearer and stronger with advancing years, and I see no reason for thinking I shall ever change them." (1862 letter to Judge J.S. Wakefield, after the death of Willie Lincoln)

John Shuey said that the following two statements are quotes from Abraham Lincoln:

"The Bible is not my Book and Christianity is not my religion..."

"My earlier views of the unsoundness of the Christian scheme of salvation..."

Here are the results from searching the University of Michigan Collected Works of Abraham Lincoln:

http://quod.lib.umich.edu/cgi/t/text/text-idx?c=lincoln&cc=lincoln&type=simple&rgn=full+text&q1=The+Bible+is+not+my+Book+and+Christianity+is+not+my+religion&cite1=&cite1restrict=author&cite2=&cite2restrict=author&singlegenre=All&Submit=Search

http://quod.lib.umich.edu/cgi/t/text/text-idx?c=lincoln&cc=lincoln&type=simple&rgn=full+text&q1=My+earlier+views+of+the+unsoundness+of+the+Christian+scheme+of+salvation&cite1=&cite1restrict=author&cite2=&cite2restrict=author&singlegenre=All&Submit=Search

Please, Mr. Shuey, cite your sources before we discuss those purported quotes any further.

While you're looking up those sources, consider these actual statements by Abraham Lincoln. I pin my understanding of the religious views of Abraham Lincoln on his own words, not the opinions of other men - men who may have had uncharitable motives.

"Four score and seven years ago our fathers brought forth on this continent, a new nation, conceived in Liberty, and dedicated to the proposition that all men are created equal. Now we are engaged in a great civil war, testing whether that nation, or any nation so conceived and so dedicated, can long endure. We are met on a great battle-field of that war. We have come to dedicate a portion of that field, as a final resting place for those who here gave their lives that that nation might live. It is altogether fitting and proper that we should do this. But, in a larger sense, we can not dedicate---we can not consecrate---we can not hallow---this ground. The brave men, living and dead, who struggled here, have consecrated it, far above our poor power to add or detract. The world will little note, nor long remember what we say here, but it can never forget what they did here. It is for us the living, rather, to be dedicated here to the unfinished work which they who fought here have thus far so nobly advanced. It is rather for us to be here dedicated to the great task remaining before us---that from these honored dead we take increased devotion to that cause for which they gave the last full measure of devotion---that we here highly resolve that these dead shall not have died in vain---that this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom---and that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth." Abraham Lincoln

http://quod.lib.umich.edu/cgi/t/text/text-idx?c=lincoln;cc=lincoln;type=simple;rgn=div1;q1=nation%20under%20god;singlegenre=All;view=text;subview=detail;sort=occur;idno=lincoln7;node=lincoln7%3A40

"With Malice toward none, with charity for all, with firmness in the right, as God gives us to see the right, let us strive on to finish the work we are in, to bind up the nation's wounds." Abraham Lincoln

"God must love the common man, he made so many of them." Abraham Lincoln

http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/a/abraham_lincoln.html

There is a contention here by John Shuey that our founding fathers were Deists. A pure Deist does not believe in revelations from God, such as in the Bible, and they don't believe that God intervenes in the affairs of men. Since human rights are surely the affairs of men, our founders were not absolute Deists - they stated explicitly that our human rights are from God; and many of them believed in that the Bible contained God's revelation.

George Washington:
"It is impossible to rightly govern a nation without God and the Bible." George Washington

"Let us with caution indulge the supposition that morality can be maintained without religion. Reason and experience both forbid us to expect that national morality can prevail in exclusion of religious principle." George Washington

http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/g/george_washington.html

"Whereas it is the duty of all nations to acknowledge the providence of Almighty God, to obey His will, to be grateful for His benefits, and humbly to implore His protection and favour..." George Washington

http://www.americankernel.com/2005/11/whereas-it-is-duty-of-all-nations-to.htm

John Adams:
"We have no government armed with power capable of contending with human passions unbridled by morality and religion. Avarice, ambition, revenge or gallantry would break the strongest cords of our Constitution as a whale goes through a net. Our Constitution is designed only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate for any other." John Adams

http://www.quotationspage.com/quotes/John_Adams/

"That they call to mind our numerous offense against the Most High God, confess them before Him with the sincerest penitence, implore His pardoning mercy, through the Great Mediator and Redeemer, for our past transgressions, and that through the grace of His Holy Spirit, we may be disposed and enable to yield a more suitable obedience to His righteous requisitions in time to come." John Adams - Proclamation of a National Day of Fasting and Prayer, March 6, 1799

"It is religion and morality alone which can establish the principles upon which freedom can securely stand. The only foundation of a free constitution is pure virtue." John Adams

"The safety and prosperity of nations ultimately and essentially depend on the protection and blessing of Almighty God." John Adams

http://www.earstohear.net/Heritage/quotes.html

Thomas Jefferson:
"Almighty God hath created the mind free. All attempts to influence it by temporal punishments or burthens . . . are a departure from the plan of the Holy Author of our religion." Thomas Jefferson

"God who gave us life gave us liberty. Can the liberties of a nation be secure when we have removed a conviction that these liberties are the gift of God?" Thomas Jefferson

http://www.monticello.org/reports/quotes/memorial.html

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."

http://www.ushistory.org/declaration/document/index.htm

James Madison:
"The eyes of all should be turned to that Almighty Power, in whose hands are the welfare and the destiny of nations" James Madison

http://www.heritage.org/research/americanfoundingandhistory/wm375.cfm

I see Mr. Shuey has studiously absorbed the seminal works of those great mental midgets, Saul Alinsky and Bill Maher. Wow...he forgot to quote the greatest journalists in the MSM today...John Stewart and Keith Olbermann. You need to volunteer for an intellectual re-fitting at Camp Look-a-weeny. In a battle of wits you are weaponless, sir. Get your facts straight. AT is the adult Big Leagues and your hurling nerf balls. As the Spanish King recently told Hugo Chavez...'Will you please shut up!'

Last week, Obama declared that America is no longer a Christian nation, but that there is room for everyone, Muslims, Jews, Hindus and so on. I believe that, but we still have to teach the truth about our Founding Fathers. America as we know it is doomed if he is elected.